this post was submitted on 07 Dec 2023
212 points (96.9% liked)

Forgotten Weapons

1648 readers
8 users here now

This is a community dedicated to discussion around historical arms, mechanically unique arms, and Ian McCollum's Forgotten Weapons content. Posts requesting an identification of a particular gun (or other arm) are welcome.

https://www.youtube.com/@ForgottenWeapons

https://www.forgottenweapons.com/

Rules:

1) Treat Others in a Civil Manner. This is not the place to deride others for their race, sexuality, or etc. Personal insults of other members are not welcome here. Neither are calls for violence.

2) No Contemporary Politics Historical politics that influenced designs or adoption of designs are excluded from this rule. Acknowledgement of existing laws to explain designs is also permissable, so long as comments aren't in made to advocate or oppose a policy. Let's not make this a place where we battle over which color ties our politicians should have, or the issues of today.

3) No Advertising This rule doesn't apply to posting historical advertisements or showing more contemporary ads as a means of displaying information on an appropriate topic. The aim of this rule is to combat spam/irrelevant advertising campaigns.

4) Keep Post on Topic This rule will be enforced with leeway. Just keep it related to arms or Forgotten Weapons or closely adjacent content. If you feel you have something that's worth posting here that isn't about either of those (and doesn't violate other rules) feel free to reach out to a mod.

5) No NSFW Content Please refrain from posting uncensored extreme gore or sexualized content. If censored these posts may be fine.

Post Guide Lines

These are suggestions not rules.

-Provide a duration for videos. eg. [12:34]

-Provide a year to either indicate when a specific design was produced, patented, or released. If you have an older design being used in a recent conflict provide the year the picture was taken. Dates should be included to help contextualize, not necessarily give exact periods.

-Post a full URL, on mobile devices it can be hard to tell what you're clicking on if you only see "(Link)".

-Posts do not have to be just firearms. Blades, bows, etc. are also welcome.

Adjacent Communities

If you run a community that you feel might fit in dm a mod and we might add your's.

Want to Find a Museum Near You? Check out the mega thread: https://lemmy.world/post/9699481

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] setsneedtofeed 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I think we understand the intended role the same. When I wrote rear line it was too hasty but meant to include troops like AFV crew. PDW are for people who aren’t meant to be using their personal weapons as part of their main role.

Another quality of PDWs is that they are not expected to be used in regular combat, but only in extraordinary circumstances. Hence accuracy at long range is not a priority, but ease of use and reliability even in messy circumstances ( dirt, heat, getting knocked around) is what matters in an emergency.

Yes to all of this. I believe I said the same thing regarding them being a used defensively.

The requirement of a PDW can be filled by various weapons, so it could be an SMG, a carbine version of an existing assault rifle

Other weapons can be used in the role, but when the category of “PDW” as weapons were being explicitly conceptualized in the 1980s at the request of NATOas a new kind of category, they were being given more armor penetrating but pistol sized rounds like 5.7mm or 4.6mm, making them submachinegun-like but more armor penetrating.

Obviously a rifle carbine can be used defensively, and that’s what ended up happening for a lot of militaries, which is part of why the dedicated PDW designs using PDW calibers, as conceived of for PDWs originally in the 80s, never took off in the way they were intended. You don’t really see any military issuing PDW of this description to all of its non-offensive or rear troops as standard practice.

Here is a NATO testing report on PDW calibers, as support that the term “PDW” was conceived to mean something specific and unique from either assault rifles or SMGs.

Here’s a link that’s got HK literature calling their MP7 a PDW. as an example of weapons of this type being explicitly called such by the manufacturer.