this post was submitted on 25 Nov 2023
263 points (77.5% liked)
Lefty Memes
4276 readers
738 users here now
An international (English speaking) socialist Lemmy community free of the "ML" influence of instances like lemmy.ml and lemmygrad. This is a place for undogmatic shitposting and memes from a progressive, anti-capitalist and truly anti-imperialist perspective, regardless of specific ideology.
Serious posts, news, and discussion go in c/Socialism.
If you are new to socialism, you can ask questions and find resources over on c/Socialism101.
Please don't forget to help keep this community clean by reporting rule violations, updooting good contributions and downdooting those of low-quality!
Rules
0. Only post socialist memes
That refers to funny image macros and means that generally videos and screenshots are not allowed. Exceptions include explicitly humorous and short videos, as well as (social media) screenshots depicting a funny situation, joke, or joke picture relating to socialist movements, theory, societal issues, or political opponents. Examples would be the classic case of humorous Tumblr or Twitter posts/threads. (and no, agitprop text does not count as a meme)
1. Socialist Unity in the form of mutual respect and good faith interactions is enforced here
Try to keep an open mind, other schools of thought may offer points of view and analyses you haven't considered yet. Also: This is not a place for the Idealism vs. Materialism or rather Anarchism vs. Marxism debate(s), for that please visit c/AnarchismVsMarxism.
2. Anti-Imperialism means recognizing capitalist states like Russia and China as such,
as well as condemning (their) imperialism, even if it is of the "anti-USA" flavor.
3. No liberalism, (right-wing) revisionism or reactionaries.
That includes so called: Social Democracy, Democratic Socialism, Dengism, Market Socialism, Patriotic Socialism, National Bolshevism, Anarcho-Capitalism etc. . Anti-Socialist people and content have no place here, as well as the variety of "Marxist"-"Leninists" seen on lemmygrad and more specifically GenZedong (actual ML's are welcome as long as they agree to the rules and don't just copy paste/larp about stuff from a hundred years ago).
4. No Bigotry.
The only dangerous minority is the rich.
5. Don't demonize previous and current socialist experiments or (leading) individuals.
We must constructively learn from their mistakes, while acknowledging their achievements and recognizing when they have strayed away from socialist principles.
(if you are reading the rules to apply for modding this community, mention "Mantic Minotaur" when answering question 2)
6. Don't idolize/glorify previous and current socialist experiments or (leading) individuals.
Notable achievements in all spheres of society were made by various socialist/people's/democratic republics around the world. Mistakes, however, were made as well: bureaucratic castes of parasitic elites - as well as reactionary cults of personality - were established, many things were mismanaged and prejudice and bigotry sometimes replaced internationalism and progressiveness.
7. Absolutely no posts or comments meant to relativize(/apologize for), advocate, promote or defend:
- Racism
- Sexism
- Queerphobia
- Ableism
- Classism
- Rape or assault
- Genocide/ethnic cleansing or (mass) deportations
- Fascism
- (National) chauvinism
- Orientalism
- Colonialism or Imperialism (and their neo- counterparts)
- Zionism
- Religious fundamentalism of any kind
(This is not a definitive list, the spirit of the other rules still counts! Eventual duplicates with other rules are for emphasis.)
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
I don't know OP, or the OOP, but I read this as criticizing liberals from the left which is something many leftists engage in all the time, I know I do
(Before I type all of this, important caveat: I am only going to be using "liberal" in the American context, meaning a milquetoast democrat. Save all of your "bUt AcTuAlLy ClAsSiCaL lIbErAlIsM" for where it's actually fucking relevant; don't bring that shit to me)
Yes, but you do it mostly because you've been taken in by these wolves. Obviously critique and push actual leftism on liberals and Democrats, but the leftism tribalism absolutely benefits the right.
Liberals aren't leftists and we shouldn't be complacent and settle for the liberal Democrat platform, but we also have to acknowledge that given the options the Democrats are absolutely the current harm-reductive choice. And importantly, unlike the fucking chudshits on the right, liberals are the demographic that can actually be reasoned with, educated, and brought into the light.
Anyone trying to tell you associating with or attempting to convert liberals is a waste of time is somebody who is only interested in stifling leftist growth.
You don't have to agree with them, but conflating them with the wastes of flesh on the right is disingenuous as fuck as absolutely motivated by agenda, either intentionally or unintentionally as matter of coercion.
Exactly there's leftists in America but no left political power, and you can't win as a leftist because it's like, "oh you don't support the government that supports a fascist genocide? Well that's how we get a fascist government!" When liberals shame leftists, who they probably agree with on every issue, for the failures of the Democrat party, I consider that more of a confession. Shaming your political allies for not being hypocritical enough rather than the party that doesn't deliver is a pathetic position to be in.
The left isn't stupid and understands strategic voting and the current state of US politics. Liberals are so quick to be condescending and love to liberal-splain how "if you don't vote Democrat we get Trump" ad infinitum. As if leftists don't understand the most basic logic. A leftist might unhappily vote Democrat out of pure strategic interest vs a liberal might take grandiose pride in their Democrat vote.
It's hard to not make fun of liberals from the left, but I find a lot of my generation are liberals by default and friendly to more leftist viewpoints. The left has little to no representation so I don't blame people for not being exposed to it. My parent's generation is a lost cause because of cold war propaganda, and the most staunch liberals I know are well-to-do genx.
When I was young I thought liberal was just "not right wing" or just the morally correct political position. It took some more life experience to understand what the liberal attitude and mindset really was.
The original sin of the left is rejecting liberalism, because liberalism is the key to political agency. It's why socialist revolutions never escape their dictatorship.
They'll downvote because this message is a threat to campists. But at the end of the day, the way forward is liberal socialism.
That's how I took this, yes.
You may be right, but I was giving OOP even less credit, assuming this was someone on the right making a bullshit, obvious strawman with others on the right as the intended audience, knowing that any semblance of accuracy didn't matter in the slightest. They don't care if it's obvious nonsense, if it makes them feel good to repeat it, that's all that matters.