this post was submitted on 18 Jun 2023
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Privacy
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Used to use Mullvad but since their port forwarding fiasco I need to switch.
(I get that they had people abusing that system, but as a privacy based service they should expect the same pitfalls as every other privacy based service, like Tor, Matrix, etc. All you can really do is keep whacking the mole, or shut it down for everyone incl. the people using it for it's intended purpose too whom you had advertised port forwarding to, who wouldn't have bought your service if it didn't have port forwarding to begin with.)
So now I'm looking at IVPN or Proton. Does anyone have experience with IVPN or know how trustworthy they are? I'm wary on Proton after Protonmail gave that French activist's IP to their Feds, and they have a free tier which usually on a VPN means they sell your data, but afaik they are the only two that'll let me PF and I have a need, a need to seed.
IIRC free tier on ProtonVPN blocks whatever peer to peer traffic they can detect.
I wouldn't worry about privacy within the contents of the VPN though, as a lot of their services do require money so they should have quite a lot of funding through the paying users (like me.)
They do what they can to promote as much privacy as possible, but email really doesn't lend itself well to that just in general. I would always suggest accessing any clearnet site through a VPN or Tor if you do sensitive work online.
I bet it does, I'll be paying whoever I go with anyway, but the just the existence of the free tier has me wary due to how every single other free VPN works. It may be that this one subsidizes the free tier with the paid or treats it as a loss leader, but "free VPN" is always sketchy without knowing that for sure, which I do not.
Regardless of monetary incentive or lack thereof, privacy remains a concern. If I were not concerned about privacy, why even use a VPN? Unfortunately, torrenting harms the Tor network, so it is not really a good alternative either.
Email isn't private, sure, but that doesn't mean that your email provider needs to snitch on you to the Feds either. I'm not wary of proton because "email isn't private," I'm wary of proton because "they directly complied with law enforcement's request to turn in an activist." Not that I want that in an email provider itself but I have a VPN. However, if they're also my VPN provider then they have my real IP. Rn, proton only has me from Mullvad and farther back from Nord, they don't know my IP to turn me in, but if I buy their VPN service, that changes, then they know everything.
Honestly I might just look into hosting myself a VPN on a VPS.
Afaik Proton only logs stuff and gives that to the feds if and after they get a coord order from the Swiss juristiction, in which case any provider would have to do that or they'll be the one taken offline with criminal charges instead. I recall Proton even being quite firm in requiring that order before doing so.
So basically, don't do criminal stuff and you'll be fine. Or at least, don't rely soley on a VPN to hide your criminal stuff 🙃.
As far as the free tiers of their services, they have the same policies but are much more limited. Pretty sure they just pay them from paying users, and use them in hope people trying it become paying users. While it's good to be wary of any free service, especially but not limited to VPNs, I don't think Proton specifically is an issue.
Personally, I'll also be wary for anything that's promoting a lot trough influencers and social media btw. Similar to free services, it's often a sign they're not that trustworthy and upstanding.
VPNs are for "illegal stuff." Namely piracy. That and monotoring of your digital things can be done in connection with real world "crimes" like drug use or activism, see: that aforementioned French activist. :upsidedownface:
That may be, but the only confirmation I have of this is your assumption, which is hardly confirmation at all, unless you own Proton.
True, though word of mouth has to come from somewhere, and I'd rather trust a guy with a legit article (hopefully one that says "IVPN servers raided, nothing found") than "GeekFeed's top 10 'no log' VPNs 2023 1. Nord 2. ExpressVPN ad that looks like it'll give me CyberGonorrhea 3. Proton.." Those podcast ad VPNs may be fine to trust for a shaver or some undies but I'm not using my VPN to watch Japanese Netflix, I'm sharing copywritten material in a country that frowns upon such actions.
You may just luck into the sale though, because they may be the one I trust most out of my 2-3 whole options all said and done. I'll make sure to pass on your u-name so you get commission if I do. Like I said though I may just go VPS once I really look into all that, I'm sick of these companies' bullshit.
A VPN service isn't for illegal stuff. It can be used that way but for me its usefulness is in providing a layer of privacy between me, my ISP and online services I use.
No, VPNs aren't for piracy, or criminal stuff. They technically aren't even for hiding your real IP. They are for connecting devices over the public network while mimicing the security of a private one, something useful for companies who need to work remotely and some other similar use-cases. It's usage for criminal stuff, getting around region locks, and all that stuff isn't it's intended purpose, but secondary purposes it turned out useful for due to the side-effects.
The fact you use a third party instead of setting up a VPN server yourself like you'd do with it's intended purpose, means that you are giving all your internet traffic to that third party. That in and of itself already creates an extra weakness. And if you do use your own server, then that server might be traceable to you instead.
Even when using a VPN for privacy, to hide your identity on the web, that doesn't mean you use it for criminal activities. Wanting privacy and secure systems isn't neccesarily linked to participating in criminal activities. People who use a VPN just for privacy, are well off with a provider that doesn't log unless a coord order is received.
People who focus on criminal activities. To be honest trusting on a VPN alone to keep you save from law enforcement is just stupid. There are too many weaknesses related to VPNs that could easily give you away if they really want to find you, even outside of the provider. They simply aren't made for that, and not as bullet proof as people think. While they are very useful for privacy usage and many of it's risks can be mitigated, it takes more than turn it on and you'll be private. Trusting that a VPN alone will keep you safe is foolish in todays age.
As for Proton not logging until they've got a court order. You don't have to assume it from me, a quick online search shows the policies at Proton as well as results of how they handled earlier court cases. Cases where authorities wanted earlier data and Proton couldn't comply because they didn't have it, and cases where they logged data they refused to do so until thry received a court order. I say results to legal cases are the best proof there is. I'd take actual trackrecord over any article, no matter what "legit guy" wrote it. Also, I've never said a thing about those sketchy top10 lists thingies, they're as bad and untrustworthy as influencer sponsorships imho. I would trust neither.
I'm not affiliated with Proton, so I have no clue what you're talking about regarding that sale paragraph...