this post was submitted on 15 Jan 2025
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I'm glad powershell is cross-platform nowadays. It's a bit saner.
Better would be to leave the 1970s and never interact with a terminal again...
What else are you going to do, though?
If you have some particular and complicated task then sure you'd probably write a program for it in a specific high-level language. But that isn't what the shell is for.
If you've already got a bunch of apps and utilities and want to orchestrate them together to do a task, that's a good shell use case.
Or if you have a system that needs setup and install tasks doing on it to prepare for running your actual workload, that's also a task which the shell is ideally suited to.
Shell scripting always has a place, and I can't see it being made obsolete any time soon.
People keep on telling me that python is a "scripting language" but honestly I would rather use the shoddiest and most barebones shell you would give me than python if I had to make a script. It all boils to interfaces, and there are more programs, libraries, and daemons that have a shell interface as opposed to whatever other "better" language there is out there. Trying to write scripts with Python or ruby or whatever will just boils down to plumbing data between external programs in a less succinct syntax. What good is type safety, try/catch, and classes if all the tools that you're using are taking in and spitting out raw text anyway?
I'm still waiting for someone to come up with a better alternative. And once someone does come up with something better, it will be another few decades of waiting for it to catch on. Terminal emulation is dumb and weird, but there's just no better solution that's also compatible with existing software. Just look at any IDE as an example: visual studio, code blocks, whatever. Thousands of hours put into making all those fancy buttons menus and GUIs, and still the only feature that is worth using is the built-in terminal emulator which you can use to run a real text editor like vim or emacs.
Quick, how do I do
for i in $(find . -iname '*.pdf' -mtime -30); do convert -density 300 ${i} ${i}.jpeg; done
in a GUI, again?🤷
I fail to see the GUI in that.
Like, if I open Dolphin, Thunar, or
winfile
.I missed where the person you replied to said to never use the terminal again, now your comment makes perfect sense. I thought you were conflating the preference for powershell with windows and therefor more GUI.
My bad, and I completely agree with you, if I had to give up CLI or GUI it would be GUI hands down no competition at all, I would die without CLI.
I’m a former (long long ago) Linux admin and a current heavy (but not really deep) powershell user.
The .net-ification of *nix just seems bonkers to me.
Does it really work that well?
It IS bonkers. As a case study, compare the process of setting up a self-hosted runner in gitlab vs github.
Gitlab does everything The Linux Way. You spin up a slim docker container based on Alpine, pass it the API key, and you're done. Nice and simple.
Github, being owned by Microsoft, does everything The Microsoft way. The documentation mentions nothing of containers, you're just meant to run the runner natively, essentially giving Microsoft and anyone else in the repo a reverse shell into your machine. Lovely. Microsoft then somehow managed to make their runner software (reminder: whose entire job consists of pulling a git repo, parsing a yaml file, and running some shell commands) depend on fucking dotnet and a bunch of other bullshit. You're meant to install it using a shitty
setup.sh
script that does that stupid thing with detecting what distro you're on and calling the native package manager to install dependencies. Which of course doesn't work for shit for anyone who's not on debain or fedora because those are the only distro's they've bothered with. So you're either stuck setting up dotnet on your system, or trying to manually banish this unholy abomination into a docker container, which is gonna end up twice the size of gitlab's pre-made Alpine container thanks to needing glibc to run dotnet (and also full gnu coreutils for some fucking reason)Bloat is just microsoft's way of doing things. They see unused resources, and they want to use them. Keep microsoft out of linux.
What type of .net-ification occurs on *nix? I am current linux "admin" and there is close to 0 times where I've seen powershell not on windows. Maybe in some microsoft specific hell-scape it is more common, but it's hard to imagine that there are people that can accept a "shell" that takes 5-10 seconds to start. There are apps written in c# but they aren't all that common?
I honestly don’t know but there must some translation happening between .net objects and *nix.
And .net “core” started supporting Linux like a decade ago. I’m guessing they’re related ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I usually only use the terminal when I don't find an alternative, but powershell usually feels a bit saner than bash.
I've also tried nushell, also nice, but in a few situations powershell despite usually being verbose was more "elegant".
What about embedded work? You gonna run a full graphical GUI on a network router?