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Intel outlines plan to break free from TSMC manufacturing — 70% of Panther Lake at Intel fabs, Nova Lake almost entirely in-house (www.tomshardware.com)

submitted 3 weeks ago by Alphane_Moon to c/technology

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[–] Buffalox 21 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (2 children)

While in reality TSMC gave Intel a 40% discount, a discount that was only discontinued, because Gelsinger trash talked TSMC!
So you are right they were dumb, but you are completely wrong about the why and how.

But of course based only on this article, it's impossible to get that part right.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Or TSMC was always planning to raise the price and Gelsinger just gave them an excuse to do so sooner while not losing face or worrying other clients too much.

[–] Buffalox 5 points 3 weeks ago

Maybe, personally I think they sold to Intel cheap to discourage them from investing heavily in production. Which of course they did anyway.
But I wouldn't be surprised if the price they had with TSMC with the steep discount, would be cheaper than Intels own production.

[+] [email protected] -7 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

If you can offer a 40% discount and still make profit, your prices are probably 3 times the cost.

If you cannot go to another supplier, you have vendor lock in.

I'm an AMD guy, so I got no skin in the game defending Intel, but if you're shilling this much for TSMC, you aren't really bringing an unbiased opinion.

[–] Buffalox 5 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

If you can offer a 40% discount and still make profit

Maybe they didn't? Or at least maybe not much.

if you’re shilling this much for TSMC

What? How am I shilling for TSMC? And I'm 100% an AMD guy myself, I freaking stuck to AMD during the whole Buldozer shitty period, because I didn't want an Intel monopoly. And I bought AMD stock when they revealed Ryzen.

So I do NOT encourage a TSMC monopoly either.

[+] [email protected] -6 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

A business easily offers a 40% discount. You didn't critically assess that, ask how, and give off vibes it was a charitable and Intel was ungrateful. TMSC while an interesting business is still a big corp with profitability at heart.

Even if Intel aren't the good guys, you cannot assume TMSC is. I like AMD, but I'm under no illusion they could throw consumers under the bus tomorrow for self interest. Right now, it's king for Linux hardware though.

[–] Buffalox 4 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

https://archive.fo/VnQUu

In public, TSMCdownplayed, opens new tab the comments, with its founder calling Gelsinger“a bit rude.” Privately, TSMC said it would no longer honor the discount, the sources said: about 40% off the $23,000, 3-nanometer wafers on which TSMC would print chips for Intel. Intel had to pay full price, shrinking its profit margin on the deal.

[–] Buffalox 3 points 3 weeks ago

and give off vibes it was a charitable

WTF! I did no such thing, that's 100% on you to put that into it. I think they did it to discourage Intel from investing too heavily in their own production which would compete with TSMC.

Even if Intel aren’t the good guys

Again WTF? Where did any of that come from? They are businesses, their purpose is to make money!

You are being delusional.