Welp, experiment is over, you guys suck at this.
Also probably about previous rules preventing them from just straight up having two teams on the grid like they used to. Either way, I welcome Toro Rosso back, may it actually give their rookies chance for victories again.
this post was submitted on 28 Jun 2023
75 points (98.7% liked)
Formula 1
5561 readers
1 users here now
c/formula1
Welcome to c/formula1.
Rules
Please keep discussions civil, respect other's opinions, and keep it friendly. Please read our rules before posting in our community.
Rules TLDR
- No spoilers in post titles please. Use of spoiler tags is considered a courtesy for now.
- No piracy discussion.
- Keep it on topic.
- No memes.
Resources
These sites are a good place to start finding out about Formula 1, aside from right here of course!
Formula1.com - the official Formula 1 website.
Formula 1 Youtube - the official F1 youtube channel.
Liquipedia Overview - what's happening now and next in a nice dashboard.
F1Calendar.com - never miss a session again!
F1Countdown.com - for those of you who like countdowns!
Sister Communities
!Motorsports - for the love of racing outside of Formula 1.
[email protected] - because you love memes.
[email protected] - let's race!
founded 4 years ago
MODERATORS
Flat out mentions they want to maintain a junior team. Is this also another way to skirt around the “cost cap”? Alpha Tauri obviously hasn’t been competitive but I feel like this team allows RBR to trial both drivers and components they may not want to risk on their main team. If the plan is to move the main hub of operation to the UK who’s not to say they won’t be sharing basically everything?
Yeah, I've never been convinced that Red Bull isn't just using AlphaTauri/Toro Rosso as a full on development program for drivers, parts, aero, you name it. I've never understood why they are basically allowed to have two teams.
There is nothing to be convinced of. This has been common knowledge ever since they bought the team from Minardi. Or did you mean something else?
I'm a relatively new fan, started seriously getting interested in 2017-2018. I guess what I mean is mainly in the second part of my comment. I don't understand why it is allowed for them to have two teams, especially under the current budget cap system. It essentially gives RB twice the operating budget, wind tunnel time, etc. compared to the rest of the grid. Other than the obvious answer of "money", why it is allowed, and why is it tolerated uncontested by the rest of the grid. If I were Ferrari, or Merc, I'd want there to be extreme scrutiny of operations for RB and TR/AT to ensure that they are operating and designing 100% independently.
The "not convinced" part is more to say that I'm not convinced that AT doesn't use some of it's allotted wind tunnel time to test aero designs for RB. Sacrifice the performance of the junior team to benefit the parent team. When you say "this has been common knowledge..." do you mean that this kind of thing is happening, and everyone knows it? If so, I don't understand the other teams on the grid not losing their collective minds over it.
$$$$$
I agree with most, the same owner shouldn't ideally be allowed ownership over more than 1 team for several mentioned and unmentioned reasons
Aren't there potential cost savings in running two teams? It seems lettings owners run two teams could help put more cars on the grid without making the sport even more expensive. I really don't know if this is the case but it seems like it could be a factor.
"The cooperation with Red Bull Racing will be closer, also in terms of cost cap and synergies."
This is a quote from Marko in this article
Oh definitely! I’m amazed that it’s not spoken about more. The value of the research output alone from another team would be huge.
There will be, especially now that FIA shut the cost cap loophole.
but that the main hub of the operation would move to the UK
Sad that we will lose the last remaining piece of Minardi.
At the very least when I say "Alpha/Alfa" I won't have to specify Romero or Tauri.
The Alfa Romeo title sponsor deal is ending in 2023 as well. Feels like a bit of a shame for AlphaTauri to rebrand when they finally can get the "Alpha" abbreviation to themselves.
But next year there will be Haas-Alfa Romeo
lemme guess, the AT clothing brand isn’t taking off like they hoped.
They should stick to overpriced sugar water
The only driver that could pull that look off is in an Alfa Romeo (and doesn’t have a mullet)
What's this paranoia over STR/AT about? The same way teams are strictly monitored regarding windtunnel and CFD time, the FIA keeps a very close watch on data pooling and sharing. And with over a thousand people involved between the teams, at least one whistleblower would have come out by now if there was any sort of high level foul play.
Regarding insinuations that there could be unfair dynamics by "owning" four drivers, academies still exist. Mercedes had Russell and Ocon racing outside their team, Ferrari always pressured their engine customers to do their bidding in tight situations. I don't see how Red Bull is different or any worse.
The Red Bull Junior Programme has been a godsend to the grid and is responsible for many great careers in F1, which wouldn't have been possible without STR/AT. I have my reservations about Marko, Horner and co, but the value RB brings to the sport is undeniable.
They'll always be Toro Rosso to me...
Good news as I've always disliked the Alpha Tauri name. Toro Rosso was better and more original.
Curious to see what they'll rename it to. Does Red Bull have any other off-shoots it wants to promote?