this post was submitted on 06 Jul 2023
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There's nothing inherently bad about propaganda. The problem with Russian propaganda is that it's trying to justify a brutal invasion that has killed hundreds of thousands of people, among them children buried in rubble by missile strikes. The US did the same after it's invasion of Iraq. It was wrong then and it's wrong now.
The USA has justified all its multiple invasions, they even justified nukes! Surely you know that Japan was nuked, twice.
Nukes ended the war and it's generally accepted that they've prevented way more deaths.
Had nuclear weapons not been used, far more people would have died.
Well, I agree that there is lots of types of propaganda.
Even selling/ promoting yourself in a good way to get a job, is considered normal, but I'm wouldn't label that as propaganda, tbh.
Imo, the type of Government propaganda I refer to is bad. I see this in the context of WorldWar 2, when it got a really bad name because the Nazis were so good at it. In Europe it still has a very bad reputation.
Also, technically, it been used almost everywhere at some time or in some form.
The difference between countries & Gvements being democratic or not, is how badly, how much, to what end, and how systematic they use it.
In the case of Russian propaganda there's been tons of news articles and YT, about how is was used to sow confusion and division amongst enemy states. You can check online the playbooks that have been leaked.
Ed.
The US has been using propaganda to justify it's atrocities, genocides, mass murders, environmental devastations, scores of violent coups, invasions, use of chemical and nuclear weapons against civilians, torture, enslavement, human trafficking, war profiteering, and massive body count for over a century. Far worse, for far longer, and far more deadly than anything Russia or the USSR has ever done.
You're right that propaganda is inherently neutral. When Euro-centric news outlets complain about Russian propaganda, it's completely and utterly without standing, as most of them are part of the US propaganda machine in big or small ways. These complaints are worthy of nothing but ridicule.
This argument is literally taken out of a" Russian propaganda for dummies' textbook.
Also what are you even saying: because USA did some bad in the past , though Russia has been doing very bad lately, Yet because it's not USA, Ruzzia is good? They have truly a fascist state man.
If you want to live in an illusion, enjoy, just be be mindful & respectful of the ones who have been suffering because of constant Russian shelling, killings and bombs. This isn't about USA, but you want to make it about them. Talking about being obsessed or something.
USA has never stopped doing some bad, ever. It is founded entirely on doing bad. It continues to do bad to this day. It is literally engaged in mass murder daily and lying about it. It's non fucking stop mass murder at the hands of USA globally and their propaganda system has poisoned nearly every single communication company you can name. Russian propaganda could never hold a candle to what the USA is doing every single day.
You say that Russia has a fascist state, yet ignore that Hitler, in Mein Kampf, literally said his vision was to replicate the US system in Europe and target the Slavs the way the USA actively oppressed the indigenous peoples in the Americas. What could literally be more fascist than the USA? It is literally the thing from which European fascism emerged and when European fascism was defeated, it was the USA (and the Vatican) that distributed Nazis into normal society, appointed them as generals of NATO, and brought them into positions of influence and power.
It was the US that developed and deployed nuclear and chemical weapons and committed the first generational mass murders in the world, literally dooming millions of future children to violent deaths from the poisons they deployed.
When NATO bombed Yugoslavia citing "humanitarian aid", they dropped thousands of tons of depleted uranium on urban populations, and the region has the highest rates of fatal cancers, childhood cancers, and violent birth defects. The US literally murders and tortures children before they are born.
The idea that a proxy war between USA and Russia isn't about USA is ridiculous. If you want to live in an illusion, enjoy, but be mindful and respectful of the people in South America who have been tortured, mass murdered, completely displaced and who have been under cultural genocide and complete environmental devastation from the US via direct and indirect military action, training and arming death squads, funding and supporting fascist coups, and dumping millions of tons of toxic waste, and dooming millions to deaths of poverty and neglect through deliberate political action - all of it covered entirely by USA propaganda.
Forgive me if I think it's disgusting when Eurocentric news outlets cry about Russian propaganda. They all deserve to be completely dismantled, and they will be eventually.
If you want to cry at USA for something they did, do it. But we are crying in Europe for what Ruzzia is doing right now in Europe.
And, the whole of EU supports Ukraine. As they are our good neighbours. So why the fuck would you someone talking about power abuses, have no respect for Ukrainians which are literally seeing whole cities destroyed on a daily basis.
I'd expect considering your tales, that you have at least would've some empathy for the victims of power abuse. Bur, no, it's all about your opinion. Me myself and I . Just wonder what your mentor Lenin would say that to that.
Ruzzia 💀 here have some reddit gold too while we're at it with redditisms
You are crying for Ukraine which is dying because the US is using it as a proxy in a war against Russia. This is the violence done to all proxies in all proxy wars. The proxies are trapped between the bigger powers. It is very sad what is happening to Ukraine. Russia and US are at war but the battlefield is Ukraine and 99% of US personnel are Ukrainian and 100% of US collateral damage are Ukrainian. Just like every conflict the US adds weapons to, it only gets more bloody and more hopeless. The US created this conflict, it created the battlefield, it created the training and the munitions, it refuses to allow negotiations, it has a strategic goal of harming Russia. It literally says it almost every month through its various mouth pieces.
We all cry for Ukraine, but some of us know where the real blame lies.
What are you waffling about? Did the US force Russia to invade Ukraine? If course not, the Russians invaded, Ukraine asked for aid to defend themselves and Europe/the US are providing the aid because it's the right thing to do.
Unless you've brought into the US libertarians nonsense that we should be encouraging peace, but have no idea of how that would work as this way is only going to end with the Russians leaving or the Ukrainians surrendering land which they won't do.
You don't know what waffling means.
Strawman
Completely naive understanding of the world.
Ad hominem
I am
Ukrainians will surrender land as soon as the North Atlantic stops feeding them weapons. And the sooner that happens, the fewer Ukrainians will die and the less additional damage the country will incur.
I just realised you're from the Tankie instance and everyone of your comments on this site shows hatred for the west in general so I'm going to leave you to your sixth form politics and call it a day.
LOL, using "tankie" and then accusing me of grade school understanding is fucking hilarious
I said "sixth form" as in sixth form college student who's just learned about political theory and thinks communism could work "if we just do it properly this time".
I'm not saying left wing politics are bad, I'm fairly socialist myself, but once you've got to the point you're defending a country invading another just because you hate the west so much you've gone too far mate.
I don't think you have any grasp of the political situation if you think your strawman represents a position anyone of reasonable political understanding holds.
The fact that you think the predominant position of "tankies" is that communism just needs to be done "right" is also evidence that your self-assessment of being "fairly socialist" is completely detached from reality. You're still fighting through Western propaganda.
The reality of the situation is war is going to happen, whether the US starts it or someone else starts it. Who starts it doesn't actually matter, what matters is the entire structure of politics around the war. I don't like war, it's terrible, but certain conditions make it necessary, and the US is far and away the architect of these conditions. The Russian invasion of Ukraine is no exception. This was a structure put in place by the US. That Russia crossed the imaginary border and made the declaration of escalation in Feb 2022 does not mean Russia holds special moral standing in this conflict. Russia assessed the same system flows that the US assessed and decided now was the time to escalate the conflict, but the conflict has been hot since 2014 and the US has been there stoking that fire since well before the bullets started flying.
If you think crossing the border and declaring the escalation holds moral standing but the entire 30 year program of the US to create these conditions does not, you might just be a standard run of the mill liberal without a hint of being "fairly socialist".
The lib couldn't possibly reply to that so he just downvoted and ran away.