this post was submitted on 30 Jun 2023
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[–] kabe 191 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (28 children)

Here is how platforms die: first, they are good to their users; then they abuse their users to make things better for their business customers; finally, they abuse those business customers to claw back all the value for themselves. Then, they die.

from Cory Doctorow's article on 'enshittification', which has become mandatory reading.

[–] cilantrillo 18 points 2 years ago (7 children)

That was a good read, the thing is that it seems that all of a sudden a lot of tech companies are getting more and more anti-consumer. I mean it’s not only the whole Reddit and Twitter thing, now Youtube is getting more aggressive with adblocking, Stackoverflow and their mod protest, Google dropping support for the open source diaper and messaging apps on Android…

Many companies are getting more aggressive against their customers, and in the end it feels like the internet as it used to be is really dying, and we might end up with the whole “dead internet theory” becoming reality. I don’t know it just feels very depressing.

[–] kabe 25 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

If you haven't already, I suggest reading Stop Talking to Each Other and Start Buying Things: Three Decades of Survival in the Desert of Social Media, a blog post by Catherynne M. Valent. (It's actually referenced in the article above.)

It's long, funny, and angry and damn, did it strike a chord with me. It was written in December, '22 so pre-Reddit meltdown but still very relevant to it.

Some highlights include:

Stop talking to each other and start buying things. Stop providing content for free and start paying us for the privilege. Stop shining sunlight on horrors and start advocating for more of them. Stop making communities and start weaponizing misinformation to benefit your betters... It’s the same. It’s always been the same. Stop benefitting from the internet, it’s not for you to enjoy, it’s for us to use to extract money from you. Stop finding beauty and connection in the world, loneliness is more profitable and easier to control.

Over and over again ... I’ve joined online communities, found so much to love there, made friends and created unique spaces that truly felt special, felt like places worth protecting. And they’ve all, eventually, died. For the same reasons and through the same means, though machinations came from a parade of different bad actors. It never really mattered who exactly killed and ate these little worlds. The details. It’s all the same cycle, the same beasts, the same dark hungers.

All ... gone. Dismantled for parts and sold off with zero understanding that the only thing of any value the site ever offered was the community, its content, its connection, its possibilities, its knowledge. And that can’t be sold with the office space and the codebase. These sites exist because of what we do there. But at any moment they can be sold out from under us, to no benefit or profit to the workers—yes, workers, goddammit—who built it into something other than a dot com address and a dusty login screen, yet to the great benefit and profit of those who, more often than not, use the money to make it more difficult for people to connect to and accept each other positively in the future.

It does end on a hopeful note, though.

Don’t ever stop talking to each other. It’s what the internet is really and truly for. Talk to each other and listen to each other. But don’t ever stop connecting. Be a prodigy of the new world. Stand up for the truth no matter how often they take our voices away and try to replace the idea of reality with fucking insane Lovecraftian shit. Don’t give up, don’t let them have this world.

Don’t get cynical. Don’t lose joy. Be us. Because us is what keeps the light on when the night comes closing in. Us doesn’t have a web address. We are wherever we gather. Mastodon, Substack, Patreon, Dreamwidth, AO3, Tumblr, Discord, even the ruins of Twitter, even Facebook and Instagram and Tiktok, god help us all. Even Diaryland.

It doesn’t matter. They’re just names. It doesn’t matter who owns them. Because we own ourselves and our words and the minute the jackals arrive is the same minute we put down the first new chairs in the next oasis. We make our place when we’re together. We make our magic when we connect, typing hands to typing hands.

Hello, world. Come in from the cold. This will be a good place. For awhile. And then we’ll make another one.

Stop buying things and start talking to each other. They’ve always known that was how they lose.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

OMG those quotes mention so many of my early internet memories. Dreamwidth. And before that, Livejournal before it sucked. And Diaryland. And Diary-X. And egroups. I miss those days so much. Twitter and Reddit weren't the first to jump the shark, by a long shot.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I cannot read that and feel how short-sighted it is. The death of online communities due to money sucks. But how about the actual death of physical people and their physical communities due to literally the exact same thing? It seems douchey to complain about capitalism killing message boards and not connect the idea at all to how it has been killing everything on earth since humans became a thing.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago

Here it is: good ol' "Whataboutism", I almost had hope that one discussion could survive without someone going "wait, what about this other thing that people know and probably care about, but is completely irrevelant to the current conversation at hand?" but ah well, today just wasn't the day, I guess.

Seriously tho, to borrow your first sentence: I can't help but read something like "But how about the actual death of physical people and their physical communities" and think...are people just incapable of caring about two seperate issues of different scales at the same time? I don't know, maybe I'm weird because I don't suddenly think of the all starving people around the world and bring them up when the topic of the closing of the food joint a couple of blocks down gets brought up by the regulars...

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Interest rates. Money isn't free anymore. It's still not super expensive but it's 5x more expensive than what it used to be since 2008.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 years ago (1 children)

This is the answer. The age of free money is over and now we are seeing the effect; rampant inflation and high interest rates. The chickens come home to roost, always.

As a result, the burn rate and runway is starting to be factors in all businesses that aren’t making a profit.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago

Yep, VCs are unwilling to just fund any old thing hoping they'll hit the lottery right now when money is "expensive".

[–] jennwiththesea 2 points 2 years ago

Thank you for answering the "why now, and why so suddenly" part. I've been really confused by this, too. Expensive money makes a lot of sense.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago

2022-'23 really has been the year of enshitification

But I think it all started with Tumblr

[–] CavalierAlbatross 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

A few companies open the floodgates and takes a lot of the blame, flak, and focus (see: Netflix, Twitter). Other companies can seize the moment and ride the wave to potentially increase profits with less blowback than they might otherwise receive.

[–] Eddyzh -1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

I mean Netflix has the community and producers thing and all but starting charging money for shared accounts and offering a cheaper version with adds is not really enshittificstion to me.

The deliver a service I pay for. That's ok.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago

I think you mean dialer.

Many companies are realizing they can screw their users over and turn a profit for their actual bosses, the shareholders. Whether that's true only time will tell.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago

Many companies are getting more aggressive against their customers, and in the end it feels like the internet as it used to be is really dying, and we might end up with the whole “dead internet theory” becoming reality. I don’t know it just feels very depressing.

With all the distributed social networks getting popular only among tech-literate people it feels like we're getting a reverse- Eternal September as well.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago

Many companies are getting more aggressive against their customers

Oh no, they are getting more friendly to their customers. The thing is, you’re not the customer, the ad companies are the customers. You’re the product they’re selling. And they want to improve the product by controlling it more.

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