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It's Clear to Everyone Gazans Must Be Destroyed, Israeli Lawmaker Says (www.haaretz.com)

submitted 11 months ago by CollisionResistance to c/world

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[–] Maggoty 2 points 11 months ago (7 children)

Hamas was literally formed as a reaction to the continued illegal occupation of Palestinian territories by Israel and the corruption of Fatah and the Palestinian Authority. That's literally a resistance group. Nobody said they weren't also culpable in some heinous shit but Israel has several politicians in ministerial positions calling for genocide, just with different words like, "Clear them out" or "significantly reduce the population of Gazans". And of the two Israel is the one with the power to do it. So yeah that's who I'm going to worry about.

[–] SCB 0 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (6 children)

Hamas was literally formed as a reaction to the continued illegal occupation of Palestinian territories

Hamas was literally formed because the Palestinian government was becoming too secular and was too interested in peace with Israel.

Here is an interview, with quotes, and details, with a literal expert on th subject who is also Pro-Palestinian.

How Hamas got elected:

KEAR: The key Fatah people - most of Fatah are living in the diaspora. They're the ones living in the four-story houses, driving around in their gold Mercedes. They're not experiencing the day-to-day privations of the occupation, whereas Hamas - they're a product of the occupation. You can see them walking in the streets. You can see them at the market. People may not necessarily agree with their narrative, with the - as an Islamist movement. They get a lot of respect for the fact that they live amongst the community.

ARABLOUEI: As the first intifada went on, many Palestinians became more and more frustrated not only with the occupation but with the PLO/Fatah as it attempted to negotiate a two-state solution with Israel.

ELGINDY: The reality was that Fatah and some of the smaller parties were interested in joining a peace process that would result in a compromise situation of a West Bank and Gaza state.

KEAR: And certainly by this stage, 1987, 20 years of occupation - what have the PLO done? When I say PLO, what has Fatah done? Nothing, virtually. We've been fighting for 20 years, resisting for 20 years. Nothing has changed. In fact, it's actually gotten worse, where we are further away from an independent state than we've ever been before.

Israel did not become aggressive to Hamas until after they began terrorist activities.

BACONI: "Hamas Contained: The Rise And Pacification Of Palestinian Resistance." When Hamas was established out of that structure and it began to engage in resistance activities...

ARABLOUEI: Like attacks on military posts and abducting Israeli soldiers.

BACONI: ...Immediately, Israel's approach to dealing with Hamas changed, and it stopped being one of approval. It started being an antagonistic relationship because obviously now it's a resistance party.

HACHAM: In retrospective, I think this was - I call it the original sin of the Israeli authorities - Israeli security authorities that did not understand that period of time what can be developed of this innocent organization movement, al-Mujama al-Islamiya.

https://www.npr.org/transcripts/1198908227#:~:text=ARABLOUEI%3A%20So%20Sheikh%20Yassin%20and,Islamist%20ideology%20created%20the%20organization.

This frustration and aggression is also detailed in the original Hamas charter

https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/hamas.asp

You don't have to agree with Israel's government, response, or how this war is being prosecuted, to understand that

1: Hamas is an islamic terror organization that usurped a government and denies democracy to millions

2: Hamas cannot and will not back down, because Jihad is their sole purpose for existing

3: A two state solution was one-track, and is always infinitely more possible with any other Palestinian leadership.

Support for Hamas is always wrong. Gazans who support Hamas today are wrong, but they do not deserve to be killed or to suffer as they have been.

[–] Maggoty 0 points 11 months ago (5 children)

Lmao, you're still trying to tie Hamas of 2023 to Hamas of 1987. Even the article you cite has the expert calling it a resistance organization. Then you add in that Jihad is their only purpose for existing. That's you. Not them. This isn't AQ/ISIS. They have one, very clear, reasonable demand that we are bending over backwards to avoid. If Israel ended their occupation and submitted to a UN mission for peacekeeping and elections Hamas would lose all of it's reason for existence. Believe it or not, people don't like to commit suicide or murder. They have to be driven to it. Militaries do it by training and indoctrination, resistance groups just hoover up broken people who were Indoctrinated by oppression.

Which is why the number one way of ending political violence always has been and always will be bringing the group into the decision making process if it's at all reasonable. That's why you see a peace process in Colombia, but cult deprogramming and military action with ISIS. As long as conservatives can count on sheep like you running around shouting, "they just hate us for no reason!" They will have cover to continue the cycle of oppression.

[–] SCB 0 points 11 months ago (1 children)

We are specifically talking about the formation of Hamas in this conversation. I was rebutting your points.

Funny you try to skim past that.

[–] Maggoty 0 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Nah son. This was the conversation at the start-

Funny how when it comes to Israeli extremists we all discuss nuance and how complicated and messy politics and language is but when it comes to extremists in resistance organizations it's immediately assumed that what they say colours the entire resistance.

Which is in response to someone breaking their back to to defend the likuud party. You don't get to move those goalposts.

[–] SCB 0 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Still running from the whole teardown eh

[–] Maggoty 0 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I'm not the one running and making excuses.

[–] SCB 1 points 11 months ago

strong disagree on that one lol

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