this post was submitted on 20 Sep 2023
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Work Reform
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A place to discuss positive changes that can make work more equitable, and to vent about current practices. We are NOT against work; we just want the fruits of our labor to be recognized better.
Our Philosophies:
- All workers must be paid a living wage for their labor.
- Income inequality is the main cause of lower living standards.
- Workers must join together and fight back for what is rightfully theirs.
- We must not be divided and conquered. Workers gain the most when they focus on unifying issues.
Our Goals
- Higher wages for underpaid workers.
- Better worker representation, including but not limited to unions.
- Better and fewer working hours.
- Stimulating a massive wave of worker organizing in the United States and beyond.
- Organizing and supporting political causes and campaigns that put workers first.
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You don't seem like you have even a toe in casual online culture, are you treating this lemmy conversation as a transactional relationship, too?
Those problems are optional, treating it formally is optional.
Just don't force people into the office just because you can't manage to chill out online.
Most of my hobbies are online actually, in fact as an expat they're the only way I stay connected to friends around the world. The majority of my really deep friendships are these days virtual.
I don't mean the conversations are formal, but the format is. As an example, a group conversation in person can have smaller side conversations going on. On video chat one at a time. Yeah you can still have good conversations, but the only one speaking limitation introduces a level of formality to the conversation. I can't lean to a friend and whisper an in joke, or comment something.
No forcing at all, if you don't want to go in, don't, I just don't think it actually does your career or relationships any favours.
That's comparable to sitting in a group chat/call and sending a dm. You can absolutely do that.
But is not nearly as easy. Conversations move faster than can type out complex thoughts most of the time. They might not even see it till minutes after. The experience is simply not the same. It leads to a very different social experience, that imo, leads to less strong relationships, especially for people joining a new company and for people on the lower end of the career ladder. I'd hate to have to seek mentorship virtually if I was a grad or junior atm.
And this is totally ignoring the fact that for a lot of people they connect over things in person. Walking by the bar on the way to the station and spotting colleagues, stopping in for a pint that turns into dinner. The walk to get lunch at the market. Sharing a homemade tiramisu. My deskmate asking about my coding problem as I swear under my breath. All things that happened this week and I only go in for 2 days, voluntarily, the rest of my team is entirely in other countries.
At the end of the day, do what you want, but the studies do show a drop in productivity for WFH. I think that stems at least partly from the social interaction elements. My counterpart is 10 years my senior in terms of ability and about as virtually social as a software developer gets, but because I'm well known in the office I get a load more of the random software questions. Which is good for me in the longer term. That's my $0.02
What the fuck kind of life is that?
Look, go to the office, have fun with the tiramisu, just don't ever argue your perceived benefits of in-person communication in support of a manager's wish to force it. I'd much prefer if you would directly argue in favor of it being kept an open option.
I am completely out of the job market right now and I really fucking hate participating in corporate culture. Fuck all of it, completely. It can all burn in a world-ending self-inflicted catastrophe. A bunch of idiots laughing over a coffee about how they're gonna earn their share from completely unnecessary and actively destructive activities. Managing the company profiles of fucking sports commentators. Designing and turning giant sheets of steel into "decorative" fucking planters.
It's just so much fluff. Meaningless, unimportant fluff. And this is what we're requiring people spend 8 hours a day for the rest of their life on.
I fucking hate our civilization.
Mate you sound totally unhinged. Sorry you're so triggered that I would enjoy casual conversation with a colleague while we try some new food together. My point was that a lot of people connect over shared experiences and the small stuff.
I'm guessing you couldn't piece together the fact I only go in 2 days a week and explicitly mentioned to do what you want that I'm not arguing everyone returns to 9 to 5 mon to Fri, but maybe you can use this as an exercise in logical reasoning. Me saying there are benefits to going into the office isn't suddenly asking everyone to go back full time.
I find it more unhinged and illogical that we see mobile game development as a more productive endeavor than picnics and naps, "You might be scamming addicts out of money, but at least you're putting in work and being productive!"
Your apparent love of corporate culture sent me fucking reeling mate.
Well don't disagree with you on that first point.
But I'm not sorry I actually like seeing people in person and aren't a total shut in. If that triggers you, seek mental help.