this post was submitted on 30 Aug 2023
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Privacy

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (16 children)

This one is a tough nut to crack, because generally I agree, but holy fucking shit we're talking about Kiwi Farms here.

There is nothing not one fucking thing that place produces that isn't a garbage fire of harassment, abuse, and violence.

Usually the EFF is spot on, but I find their argument in this case pretty weak. While I think there are better ways to handle this as well than straight censorship, like give me a break, EFF, no one is doing anything about these scumfucks. I would give one shit about such an argument if I felt there was anything that would happen to stop this, but I'm pretty fucksure it won't. If I felt like law enforcement was closing in and as was going to charge everyone involved in the site under some sort of gang-harassment law (which probably doesn't even exist), then maybe this argument would hold weight. But I don't feel like that, and I feel like the more people make weak arguments for horrendous places like this, more vulnerable people will continue to suffer Kiwi Farms abuse, harassment, and violence.

To put it even more simply: When a person uses a room in a house to engage in illegal or just terrible activity, we don’t call on the electric company to cut off the light and heat to the entire house, or the post office to stop delivering mail. We know that this will backfire in the long run. Instead, we go after the bad guys themselves and hold them accountable.

Who the fuck is actually doing that, EFF?? You're basically arguing for endless abuse from these fucks because the justice system doesn't give one fucking shit about what they're doing because the justice system doesn't generally give a fuck about vulnerable people.

That’s what must happen here. The cops and the courts should be working to protect the victims of KF and go after the perpetrators with every legal tool at their disposal. We should be giving them the resources and societal mandate to do so. Solid enforcement of existing laws is something that has been sorely lacking for harassment and abuse online, and it’s one of the reasons people turn to censorship strategies. Finally, we should enact strong data privacy laws that target, among others, the data brokers whose services help enable doxxing.

  1. ACAB, the cops are corrupt and you can't trust them.
  2. The courts are corrupt and you can't trust them.
  3. We're living in a hell-hole of a gerontocracy where government can't pass a fucking bill to end Daylight Savings time, and you expect them to do something about policing this when we can't even get cops to do their fucking jobs without murdering innocent citizens in the process? Get the fuck out of here, EFF, you're a joke now.
[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

@dingus @zquestz the EFF is literally doing the "it's not okay to ban Hitler from sitting just because he has different opinions" thing

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

If it goes one way, it can go the other way too. Imagine if a political party bribed some T1s with a ton of money to just not carry any messaging by their opponents, and force sites to remove it or go offline.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

This is my concern. I can foresee this going horribly wrong down the road, and as an LGBT+ person in the US who also has some unpopularly left-of-center opinions, that frightens me.

I hurt my brain trying to think of exactly what should be done about platforms like Kiwi Farms though, because I agree they shouldn't be allowed to exist.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

@Jamie You're now doing "If we can do bad things to Hitler then Hitler can do bad things to us."

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

It's more like if you give someone random the power to jail someone without due process, we can all cheer as long as they use the power right. But then if we give that person the power, Hitler also gets the power and uses it to jail Jewish people.

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