this post was submitted on 16 Jun 2023
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What makes the space toxic? It just seemed like they were trying to make an inclusive space and had issues being able to moderate homophobia and anti-trans bigotry coming from these two instances and are finding alternative options. I understand why many (myself included) wouldnt like this, but I haven't seen much toxicity inside the actual instance.
Lol "anti-trans bigotry" so like I said, toxic as fuck. Those anti-*ism and anti-*phobe communities are always toxic, and not only because they typically allow and encourage certain *isms and *phobias. Oh, and socialism is the top community there, you know the deadliest ideology in modern human history.
Oh, and this is an interesting read.
Being anti-transphobia is not toxic.
And wow, thanks for linking to a completely random post of a singular person's negative experience with bottom surgery, you using that incredibly specific post certainly doesn't tell us what you think of trans people.
People love to find rare negative examples and signal boost them to the stars, if they don't like something. I wish people were trying harder to be the people Mr. Rogers knew they could be.
Examples like this are not rare. There is very much an unwritten rule within the trans community that you are not allowed, under any circumstance, to voice any negative experiences with transition. That's why the trans community is also so hostile towards detransitioners even attempting to take over r/detrans on Reddit.
I went to r/actual_detrans to ask for negative experiences and reasons not to have surgery before I went ahead with it. I didn't ask on r/detrans because it was TERFy AF when I went looking for possible information sources. I wouldn't have participated in a takeover effort, though. That's shitty.
Toxic positivity is real.
That having been said... Yes, rare. Detransition is rare. On a planet of multiple billions of people, yes, you can find "a lot" of people, in terms of strict numeric count, but they're a tiny fraction of all people who transition.
See, the community is never going to get anywhere nor gain any support if it just labels anything it doesn't like as "TERF." Yes, people in r/detrans are going to be angry, can you fucking blame them? They were lied to, groomed, and now they have to live with the after effects for the rest of their lives. I'd be pissed too if I had allowed myself to be groomed like that (which was attempted, btw).
Except this stat is highly disingenuous. For one thing it's heavily susceptible to survivorship bias (since, you know, many people that are unhappy choose the "other" method) and second off detransition is just something that's getting attention so all data on the issue will be unreliable. There's also heavy sampling bias at play, every study I've read over asks the person right after transition, during their honeymoon period, and never follows up with the person. There's also the toxic positivity that you admit exists, they could fear retaliation if they answer honestly on such a survey.
So, first off:
I'm not your enemy. We haven't met before now, I'm not the person or people who did any of those things to you, and dumping a bucket of rage onto me isn't going to teach them anything nor in any way improve the situation.
Second, it seems a little weird to be hostile to me, reporting about a community I found to be hostile, by saying, "Well of course they are, a community was hostile to them!" Surely you see the cyclic nature this only perpetuates.
Third, since I, you know, had a post in r/actual_detrans where I had conversations as well as participating in the community for more than a year following that, where I thought I had a contribution to make, and did so to a positive reaction locally, it's pretty clear to me that it is possible to both find that actually, you do identify more with your birth gender, and not be hostile to people who don't.
I'm sorrowful for your situation, but I didn't cause it and almost certainly had no opportunity to influence it. I don't want to be your enemy, but that is a relationship does not require two to tango. One can unilaterally decide that, and it has to be a decision on the part of those who made that decision, to revoke it.
Well, if one community didn't put them in the situation to begin with maybe there'd be no anger at all? I mean, just looking at what's going on in the world both Sweden and the UK have banned puberty blockers for children and the UK is shutting down its gender clinic, the largest in the world might I add, next year for massive malpractice. Just to point out how significant that is, Sweden was at the forefront of gender therapy for minors and the UK was not far behind, so it's very very telling that they're taking these actions. So, maybe, one side of the issue is much larger than the other?
"Yeah guys it's ok to swarm someone and tell them to kill themselves for coming out about their experiences being less than perfect, we're really just soooo accepting uwuwuwuwu"