this post was submitted on 09 Jul 2024
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[–] [email protected] 13 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Go on then: what definition do they use?

Natural means pretty much "element of the physical universe, identified by observation".

You're claiming in another comment to this thread that you have M.Sc., you should be aware of this, please stop wasting everyone's time.

Slapping “quantum” in front of something generally makes it involve indeterminism (excepting the many-worlds interpretation)

Indeterminism is by no means non-natural, and it does not make things any less observable. We can observe quantum states just fine.

And as for

Yeah all the Bell stuff

"All the Bell stuff" doesn't have anything to do with "Didn’t some quantum nondeterminism prove the existence of effects without a natural cause?"

And no, it didn't. AFAIK there are exactly zero physicists who argue that.

You made a ludicrous claim, and are unable or unwilling to back it up even a bit, yet somehow you feel continuing this without anything to show is a good use of anyone's time. If you are not going to make an actual argument, I do not see value in continuing this conversation, as all it does is make this thread more difficult to read for others who most likely are not very interested watching yet another internet argument sidethread.