68
The White House puts forced confession under israeli torture on their official Youtube channel as "evidence".
(lemmy.world)
Thanks Joe Biden for approves the torture of Palestinians and uses it to launder rape hoaxes. No evidence? No problem! Just torture a Palestinian and put it on the Youtube channel!
You're making things up again.
I never claimed there was photo or video evidence of rape. The UN claimed that.
I'm not defending Israel.
I'm clarifying your inaccuracies and out-of-context implications.
Here are the facts:
Rape is an extremely common war atrocity.
a UN report has stated that from photographic, video and interview evidence, rape was likely committed by Hamas.
I don't at all disagree with your main conclusions, but some factual nitpicks:
The UN didn't claim there was photo or video of rape actually happening. The whole thing is sort of a red herring, an artful construction to ask a different question other than "was there rape?" in order that the answer can be no.
UN report on Sexual violence during the October 7th attack
UN report on war crimes in general during the conflict, of which sexual violence by both Hamas and the IDF forms a part
A lot of the UN's reports actually don't weigh in on the question of whether the rape that was committed on October 7th was done by Hamas fighters or by an associated body of Palestinians that accompanied them. In a lot of cases there was no way to tell what the affiliation of the man involved in any given instance was, although he was obviously part of the general body of the attack, and so they simply stuck to saying, rape happened.
Like I say, no real disagreement with your main point, just some nitpicks. Linkerbaan has for whatever reason picked the one pro Palestinian thing he could go to bat for that makes him look like the monster, and where the actual evidence makes the Palestinian side into the bad guys. It's weird. There is not a shortage of things to bring up that make the Israelis the bad guys.
You are conflating evidence with undeniable proof.
There is lots of evidence of rape.
There's no undeniable proof of rape
The UN collected and checked a lot of evidence.
From thousands of pictures, hundreds of videos and about three dozen witness testimonies submitted or provided as evidence , the panel concluded there are "reasonable grounds to believe that conflict-related sexual violence occurred in multiple locations during the 7th October attacks, including rape and gang rape"
Dude I am 100% on your side on all of that. If anything I was saying sounded like I was saying rape didn't happen, that wasn't the intent. Just factual nitpicks about details of what the report itself did and didn't conclude.
I have no problem with nitpicks, only accuracy.
You got your nitpick wrong.
I wrote
" I never claimed there was photo or video evidence of rape. The UN claimed that."
You wrote
" The UN didn't claim there was photo or video of rape actually happening".
You are responding to a claim that never occurred .
You are arguing against the claim that the UN has photo or video of rape actually happening, but nobody made that claim in the first place.
Again, you're conflating evidence with undeniable proof.
The UN collected and checked evidence, then concluded there are "reasonable grounds to believe that conflict-related sexual violence occurred in multiple locations during the 7th October attacks, including rape and gang rape".
Your nitpicks, based on the assumption that somewhere there is a claim of the UN having video or photo proof of rape, are based on either a misunderstanding of the quoted statement or a misunderstanding of my comments.
Which, if I can add, is totally fine. I make mistakes all the time.
I just figured, if we're nitpicking, might as well do it right.
Let me try a different way: I'm saying you're leaving the door open, just a little bit, for someone to come in with a red herring reframing of the question.
Saying the UN found photo and video evidence of rape is technically accurate but it leaves a little window open for someone to try to get into an irrelevant discussion about photos and videos and what people didn't find in the videos. I would just focus on, there is strong evidence of rape, more like you did in your more recent message.
Saying rape was likely committed by Hamas leaves a similar little window open, since the report actually specifically stayed away from the question of which men out of the invading force (not all of whom were Hamas) were doing the raping, since that's pretty hard to determine. To me it is safe to conclude that a lot of it was done by Hamas, but the report doesn't do that, because it is trying to be rigorous about definitively proving everything that it's saying.
That is my input. You're free to conclude it's not warranted of course. Again: I agree with you. Cheers.
The UN did not find photo and video evidence of any rape happening you clearly did not read the report.
Israel showed them pixelated photos from ZAKA with a made up backstory where if you let the Hasbara imagination fill in the details enough you can imagine rape happening.
Even Patten had to conclude that there were in fact no photos or videos of actual rape because blurry pictures with Hasbara descriptions don't count. The report specifically mentioned that the blurry pictures are not evidence of rape depictions
The only reason photos and videos are mentioned is to trick people that cannot read well or won't read the whole report into thinking there's evidence because the Patten report was an israeli invited tour. There is none.
@[email protected] have fun 😃
Haha, cheers, have a good day
Even without leaving a window, I'm privy to constant misrepresentations of the quotes I provide or my comments themselves.
Keeping that eventuality in mind, I tend to stick with the accuracy of the statement itself rather than branch off into possible extrapolations and just take each comment as it comes.
Luckily I have a ridiculous amount of free time, so it's fun for me to craft careful statements and at least as intellectually fun to analyze and dismantle inaccurate criticisms or disputes.
I appreciate comments that forward the conversation or communicate honestly, but I have the patience and disposition to address any type of rejoinder.
Thanks and have a good rest of your day!