this post was submitted on 24 Aug 2023
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Enough Musk Spam

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For those that have had enough of the Elon Musk worship online.

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[–] MajorasMaskForever 38 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I'm no fan of Musk, not by a long shot. Working in the aerospace industry, the vast majority of us have an extreme dislike of the guy, especially for stealing credit.

But what SpaceX does for hiring is correct. This wasn't them arbitrarily deciding things, pretty much every aerospace company that does work with ITAR or EAR material gets told that American citizenship is required if the person will be anywhere near that kind of material. Even if your job function isn't related, if there's a chance you can see it you need to be able to legally do so.

Seems strange for the DoJ to go after just SpaceX in this one since I know LHM, Boeing, NG, Raytheon, etc, if you're in a facility that has ITAR/EAR stuff you need to be a citizen.

[–] thessnake03 7 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Does ITAR apply when it's independently developed product for commercial use like SpaceX, as opposed to some form of government owned IP with those other companies?

I'm sure there's differences. I would think SpaceX has wayyy less export controlled info, so hiring foreign nationals shouldn't be a deal breaker.

[–] MajorasMaskForever 4 points 1 year ago

ITAR technically applies to all US Citizens, the only exception I'm aware of is in a university research setting. The text of the law is pretty short and boils down to anything that the US Government deems military technology or technology that can be used against the US must remain within the US unless written permission to "export" that technology is granted by the department of state. In this case "export" means the information leaving US soil or where you can't prove that the information hasn't left US soil. So if you're talking about some controlled technology in the middle of nowhere Kansas and happen to be next to some German tourist? Boom: Export.

From there you find yourself dealing with EAR on exactly what counts as an export and how to handle the export process. Exports happen all the time legally but they're all funneled through the DoS. If you don't control your exports the DoS starts getting fine-happy and if you do it enough times your company gets disbarred so all those sweet sweet over charged contracts that Musk likes to hide and distract from go away.

One method of controlling your export is to make sure that US citizens are the only people in your facility. That's why SpaceX's policy makes sense

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

From briefly having worked on a project where this was a relevant issue, and I had to throw good people of foreign nationality off the team due to higher up NASA decisions: ITAR also becomes relevant when you want to access data and hardware that is ITAR regulated for use in your mission. This is the case for all space missions -- even for SpaceX, who likes to do things in-house -- since the advanced electronics, alloys, etc. will come from elsewhere and fall under regulation.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Is there a specific law for this?

[–] Bassman1805 15 points 1 year ago (2 children)

It's not one specific law, it's a whole ton of them. ITAR (International Trade in Arms Regulations) is the keyword to use if you wanna look into it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

On a completely unrelated note, does your username have a fishing or musical origin?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)
[–] Bassman1805 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

Then we're cut from the same cloth friend :)

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

Ah ok I see.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

My partner is a refugee and very active in her global community of refugees. I showed her this headline and said, “He’s your enemy, too.”

[–] MotoAsh 30 points 1 year ago

Yep. Dude turned off StarLink on Ukraine because he already got the good PR with shipping units over and was butthurt the Pentagon wouldn't pay for something he donated.

He is an ally of no one. He is literally an enemy of humanity to anyone who posesses humanity.

[–] mindbleach 1 points 1 year ago

Not where I would start, but go off.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I am zero percent surprised that the South African native Elon has corporate discrimination against non-us citizens.

Lack of self awareness and outrageous levels of hypocrisy is very on brand.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago

You mean to tell me the man who got rich off using daddy's money, who in turn got rich off apartheid slave labor, is a piece of shit? Well I never