this post was submitted on 19 Sep 2023
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Who said anything about a utopia? I'm talking about one aspect, a belief in an American Democracy/Republic (I know the D word triggers some people out there and that's not the conversation right now). If you read our founders writing they considered public debate to be the best way to maintain that project because the previous government would jail you for criticism. That's it. That's the reasoning and context. Nobody claimed it was perfect
I'm aware, what period of time are you speaking of.
You need to narrow down your founding fathers since approximately a third were openly and objectively anti democratic.
The period of time regardless of what era you choose is not as you portray it.
Narrow your argument says the dude who’s made 0 actual claims and instead chooses to do the old “you’re just wrong” approach straight out of the gate.
Thanks for the empty conversation
Not sure to what actually he's refering to but he's not wrong though. The foundation of ours "western liberal democraties" wasn't really the ideal we have today about what democracy is or even worst it wasn't either the preffered regime of a large part of the rulling classes at that time.
In order to not have an empty conversation :
The Political Power of Words: The Birth of Pro-democratic Discourse in the Nineteenth Century in the United States and France
“I don’t know what he’s talking about but he’s right”
Nah fam.
I'am pretty sure you get what I mean. I can't speak in the name of the guy and since he didn't developed his point or give references I can only assume what he mean't and I can be wrong, yet the statement in itslef is not wrong.
I developed a bit more my point and gave you a reference that leads to more references if you find the subject interessting...
It's kind of ironic from you to complain about and empty conversation and do the exact same thing right after.
Can you blame me? I can’t read your mind but your opening fucking statement to me was that you don’t understand what the guy was talking about but you agree with him.
Would that make you feel confident when talking to someone who’s trying to convince you of their viewpoint.
Don’t turn your nose up at me when you’re the one who shit on the sidewalk.