this post was submitted on 03 Oct 2024
158 points (97.6% liked)

News

23422 readers
5045 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil


Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.


2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.


Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.


3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.


Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.


4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.


Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.


5. Only recent news is allowed.


Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.


6. All posts must be news articles.


No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.


7. No duplicate posts.


If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.


8. Misinformation is prohibited.


Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.


9. No link shorteners.


The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.


10. Don't copy entire article in your post body


For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] GreenKnight23 -1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

no it's not.

anyone with eyes can see this is the price paid to have a militarily significant position against the real enemy, Russia.

sure, there is much gnashing of teeth and shouting of change but it's all political theater.

[–] [email protected] -2 points 1 month ago (2 children)

I don’t feel that’s obvious, can you elaborate on your views?

[–] GreenKnight23 7 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Israel is a strategic location for the US to maintain military power in both the Middle East and northern Europe.

The US has access to nuclear capable weapons in Israel and that keeps Moscow in check.

current leadership in Israel is well known to be sympathetic to Russian influence and is likely tempted by the goal to eradicate all Muslims, something Moscow is likely to allow.

Should Israel defect to Putin's regime, the US would lose military influence and superiority in the area and it would likely set the US back decades.

for Iran to attack Israel, they are forcing the US to make a choice. Publicly commit to be in cooperation with the administration that continuously commits crimes against humanity, or to step away from supporting the admin and thus step away from a strategic point.

Without the support of the US or Russia Israel will fall, it's only a matter of time. at that point Iran is in the best position to take over and they will do so through Iraq and Jordan.

it's in Russian best interests to support both Iran and Israel to fight so the US continues to focus assets on stabilizing Israel instead of Ukraine. To them, it doesn't matter who wins or loses. As long as both Israel and Iran play Moscow's game, Russia wins.

Furthermore, Russia can use the turmoil and brutal imagery from Israeli forces and sow the seeds of propaganda online of, "look what Joe Biden is doing! Do you want more of this?"

Russia wants a Trump presidency because they get everything they want. They get US out of Israel, out of Ukraine, and would have a singular position in Germany, which is weak when it stands without Israel.

It's pathetic how afraid Moscow is of Harris, especially when they talk a big talk about how big their nuclear dicks are.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 month ago

I feel a few points above aren’t correct from my knowledge, can we discuss?

Israel is a strategic location for the US to maintain military power in both the Middle East and northern Europe.

I agree Israel provides intelligence to the US, and there are some bases in the country, but I disagree with its importance in the overall power projection, especially with our access to saudi arabia. Also, the us and israel have a love/hate relationship, well demonstrated by the USS Liberty incident.

The US has access to nuclear capable weapons in Israel and that keeps Moscow in check.

The israeli arsenal is generally believed to be american uranium and stolen british nuclear secrets, and is not controlled by the us. Even if the us had some say in the use of this arsenal, this is a pittance of what the us would have available. So this doesn’t strike me as a strong argument.

current leadership in Israel is well known to be sympathetic to Russian influence and is likely tempted by the goal to eradicate all Muslims, something Moscow is likely to allow.

This argument is the most confusing; russia is making close ties to chechen leaders and has muslim countries in its sphere of influence. Israel just bombed a russian weapon depot, and the putin regime is denouncing israelli actions of late.

I agree trump would be best for russia (and israel actually, his isolationist policies are horrible for us power projection), but russia needs iranian weapons to support its ukraine war effort. Iran at war will cause shahed deliveries to be redirected and hurt russia’s ability to degrade ukranian air defenses and infrastructure. Russia seems to be playing a soft political support for iran and the muslim countries because there is no cost to do so, and I feel your argument about their preferring a fight to weaken the democrats is a good one, just not with one of their major weapon suppliers in their current war efforts.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 month ago

A Trump presidency means US out of Israel and Iran? How so? Trump and his advisors have done way more to hawk a war with Iran than Biden/Harris. Trumps actions while in office were also very supportive of Israel and antagonistic to Palestinians, leading to more attacks on Israel and more US involvement.

[–] InverseParallax 1 points 1 month ago (2 children)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/04/13/evangelicals-israel-gaza-republicans/

The only way we got Ukrainian aid was by passing Israeli aid.

I don't like it either, but it's a price I'm willing to pay to stop Russia and China from expanding their despotism.

I know you disagree and would rather sell Ukraine down the river for Gaza, and good for you, but if Ukraine fell in 2012 domestic pressure on Xi to take Taiwan would be unstoppable, and this is exactly how WW2 started, momentum, we need to make invasion too expensive to contemplate.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 month ago

You were doing very well until you started telling me the views you planted to argue against.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (2 children)

The only way we got Ukrainian aid was by passing Israeli aid.

Yes, that's the problem. Why not fund the defense of ukraine and palestine?

I don’t like it either, but it’s a price I’m willing to pay

You're willing to collaborate with genocidal fascists? Gross.

to stop Russia and China from expanding their despotism.

Fascism won't stop fascism. This isn't a baseball game. Grow up.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 month ago

Thanks for telling us you have no nuanced intelligence, monochromatic imbecile.

[–] InverseParallax -1 points 1 month ago

You're willing to collaborate with genocidal fascists? Gross.

There's something wrong with you, I don't know if it's ignorance or what.

We sided with Stalin against Hitler.

Fascism did stop fascism, very well in fact, it's one of the few things that does because only fascists are willing to spend lives like they are.